ceramic coating

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hawkwind
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ceramic coating

Post by hawkwind » Thu Apr 18, 2013 1:25 pm

Ok having found a supplier for ceramic coatings I needed to try it out ,so what better way than mixing up a new batch of headers.

Seeing as far as I could research the combination of turbo and nitro produces a very hot exhaust ...so the old mild steel headers would not be up to the task. I managed to track down some 310 stainless tube and bends which is not easy :shock: ...310 has a good ability to hold up under high heat .....better than 304 im told ....so with the material and my old and trusty gas axe we rustled up these.
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Vehicle......................A new creation.
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Rider......................... Tardus Vetus Inflatio

hawkwind
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Re: ceramic coating

Post by hawkwind » Thu Apr 18, 2013 1:59 pm

Next sand blast to clean and give a key for coating.
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Vehicle......................A new creation.
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hawkwind
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Re: ceramic coating

Post by hawkwind » Thu Apr 18, 2013 2:05 pm

And finally coat and bake ....... the ceramic coating is a water based liquid with over 75% solid content so stir well and use a touch up gun on about 40psi....these were sand blasted inside and out and coated inside and out ...you allow to air dry until flashed off then bake at 250C for 30 minutes and presto done at less than 1 tenth the cost of sending away to do :D I added 4 screw in holes for the EGT probes seen near the flange.
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Vehicle......................A new creation.
Designed by................Troglodyte.
Engineered/ built by......Rustic.
Financed by.................Nickles & Dimes.
Rider......................... Tardus Vetus Inflatio

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ROSS BROWN
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Re: ceramic coating

Post by ROSS BROWN » Tue Apr 23, 2013 11:44 pm

hawkwind wrote:so with the material and my old and trusty gas axe we rustled up these.
Image

Gary
Until I saw it on UTUBE , welding stainless steel with a gas torch was an unknown..
........NOT RECOMENDED.....
Stainless steel hates being boiled ,it makes it extremly brittle ...(and you have certainly boiled it.)
Yep allright for ornamental pieces and pieces that are not going to see a load..
But in the turbo nitro methanol inviroment you expect it to exist in .. it does not stand a chance..

It is for reasons like this... I strongly recomend that constuction pictures of competition "A" bikes
be sent to scuitineres for assement.. or begin a build diary ..

Ross..
IT IS ALL A RACE AGAINST TIME.
TIME WAITS FOR NO ONE.

HOW FAST CAN YOU GO ?

S/UF 925

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RGV
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Re: ceramic coating

Post by RGV » Wed Apr 24, 2013 6:45 pm

Get some stainless sticks, it welds beautifully with a DC stick welder. Or take it somewhere and get it TIGed or MIGed up.

Your exhaust will see the same or more pressure as the boost your developing im guessing?

Dave

Last Minute Racing "its a 2-stroke ya twit - Its supposed to smoke"
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gennyshovel
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Re: ceramic coating

Post by gennyshovel » Wed Apr 24, 2013 8:13 pm

RGV wrote:Get some stainless sticks, it welds beautifully with a DC stick welder.
Dave
Yeah,,even I could weld it, plus, the discolouration tells ya how good a job ya did, then ya pickle it, wahla, purdy
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hawkwind
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Re: ceramic coating

Post by hawkwind » Thu Apr 25, 2013 7:39 pm

mmmmm gas welding stainless is an unknown??? been doing it for years ...I better tell all my other headers they don't stand a chance so they can crack or break also ....Seriously I have never had a failure yet but then again I have never attempted to use nitro and meth through a turbo before and neither has anyone else that i'm aware of ..... These headers are going for a 10/12 hour workout on the dyno so I will watch closely to see if they fail :shock: I hope you are not correct. Oh and the headers and turbo are supported in 3 places and im very interested in seeing how the ceramic coating inside and out holds up.

This is a quote from a well know welding resource in there Q & A.

7.       Can I use an Oxy/Acetylene torch to weld stainless steel? – Yes, stainless steel can be welded with an oxy/acetylene torch.  A good welding flux which protects the welding zone from oxygen should be used.  Also, the torch should be carefully adjusted use a carburising flame minimizing excess oxygen which causes the oxides mentioned above.  Trying to weld thin-walled tubes with oxy/acetylene is not for the faint of heart (or talent).

Thanks for your concern :)
Vehicle......................A new creation.
Designed by................Troglodyte.
Engineered/ built by......Rustic.
Financed by.................Nickles & Dimes.
Rider......................... Tardus Vetus Inflatio

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AuotonomousRX
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Re: ceramic coating

Post by AuotonomousRX » Thu Apr 25, 2013 10:01 pm

Gary what Turbo are you using for this project?

Pete
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Pete :shock:
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hawkwind
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Re: ceramic coating

Post by hawkwind » Fri Apr 26, 2013 7:36 pm

Pete.....Im using a hybrid, compressor side is a TO4e 46 trim ( and I have a 50 trim wheel as well) keeps me in the max island all the way to 36psi and the turbine side is a TO4 T61 0.86 a/r...the turbine side was a TO3 68a/r tried to get a 1.15 a/r but they wanted 750 just for the snail and 350+ postage :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: ...anyway the turbine I have now will do the job of maintaining minimum back pressure at wot.
Vehicle......................A new creation.
Designed by................Troglodyte.
Engineered/ built by......Rustic.
Financed by.................Nickles & Dimes.
Rider......................... Tardus Vetus Inflatio

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AuotonomousRX
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Re: ceramic coating

Post by AuotonomousRX » Sun Apr 28, 2013 8:13 pm

Gary

A Nitromethane Turbo combo is pretty uncommon from what I can find.

Do you know why this is?

Pete
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Pete :shock:
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Greg Watters
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Re: ceramic coating

Post by Greg Watters » Mon Apr 29, 2013 10:23 am

Image

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AuotonomousRX
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Re: ceramic coating

Post by AuotonomousRX » Mon Apr 29, 2013 5:52 pm

Ahh Greg

A picture is worth a thousand words.

What actually would cause that? The wrong tune as in Jetting/Ignition or a Turbo specific problem?

From what I have seen over the years at the Drags, Nitro Tuning is a precarious business (given the %s are very high).

Not only nailing the correct tune, but maintaining a constant load on the Engine in order to achieve a controlled combustion.

I think I also remember something about using Cylinder Head inserts in 4 Valve Nitro engines to assist combustion???

I'd imagine trying to control the rapidly expanding "Nitro Exhaust" that the turbine "sees" through the Wastegate another challenge over say a Methanol Turbo deal?

Pete
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Pete :shock:
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hawkwind
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Re: ceramic coating

Post by hawkwind » Mon Apr 29, 2013 6:47 pm

Hahaha Greg now that I have control again ...yes that is one reason, nitro is very expensive in more than one way....Pete there are a couple of answers....very few racing organisations allow nitro ( drag racing ...hill climb ... LSR... others ??? ) drag racing wont allow turbo and nitro I believe...very few ppl have tried it .....a lot of problems if using high amounts of nitro as it is still burning when the exhaust valves open and it has the potential to burn up to 5000+ deg F...all the sources I found claim it makes obscene amounts of HP and destroys a lot of stuff in doing so ( that is the turbo route)......I plan on using a far greater amount of methanol than pop the max I will try is 30% nitro ....again almost zero information ( public) on smaller % and turbo .....maybe others have tried it ???? ....but the small amount of information I have via the net and books says there is good potential in the combo at least in theory.....Im game enough to give it a try.

If anyone has personal experience in using lower % mixes and a turbo I would love to hear how it went .....not interested in hearsay or Chinese whispers.
Vehicle......................A new creation.
Designed by................Troglodyte.
Engineered/ built by......Rustic.
Financed by.................Nickles & Dimes.
Rider......................... Tardus Vetus Inflatio

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Greg Watters
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Re: ceramic coating

Post by Greg Watters » Mon Apr 29, 2013 7:19 pm

actually not positive that was nitro, but an alky blend i brought in the US in 09 that would not pass the water test , started cold easily, and the exhaust note realy cracked compared to straight methanol and methanol / acetone blends

My main issue was volume
started adding up amps , and by the time i had a very high energy inductive ign system , water pumps for the intercooler, big fuel pumps for the methanol wideband O2 and all the rest of the bike electrics i was in the red

currently planning my next methanol motor in the liner and it will have mechanical fuel and electric water pumps, very low amperage to push water around at a few psi comparted to the 75 or so psi required for fuel

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AuotonomousRX
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Re: ceramic coating

Post by AuotonomousRX » Mon Apr 29, 2013 7:54 pm

Greg

Volume is a problem with Methanol, so adding the Nitro part at 1.7:1 AFR :shock: big pumps are needed.

Gary

That's why I asked, I was looking for info a while ago and it is pretty light on. Nothing specific.

I was looking for turbo 2 Stroke info and sort of wandered off looking at Nitro stuff as well, same thing, not a lot of info, but at least the 2 Stroke Turbo ( not with Nitro) thing has been done. Degree of difficulty +++ lol.

Keep us posted.

Pete
Metric Target 250 on a 250 on a Red Bike

Pete :shock:
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