Post record run inspection.

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JonB
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Post record run inspection.

Post by JonB » Mon Mar 26, 2012 10:22 am

Hi.
I have no intention of cheating and believe that the majority of others are the same.

The pre run scrutineering is for safety compliance only and should stay that way.
For our records to have any credibility a class compliance needs to be done on a vehicle that has set a record.

I understand fuel is very hard to check, other areas are not so hard.

I also understand that it is pretty difficult for someone to know the whole rulebook, I have a decent handle on the bike rules and no knowledge of the car section that isn't related to a Streamliner bike build.

If we split it into bikes and cars, then mornings and afternoons it is 20 spots to fill.

I am happy to give up 1/2 a day to do tech on bikes that set records, I'm hopefull that 19 other builders would do the same.

I would have thought you couldn't do tech on your own car/bike and you would have to be okayed by your state comitee to be able to fill the role.

We all want to race, and we have trouble getting volunteers, this and some other critical roles should come with a "cue jump pass" you commit 1/2 a of "race" day, you get to cue jump once the next day.

Jon
DLRA#1115
Underhouse Engineering

IN2VWS
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Re: Post record run inspection.

Post by IN2VWS » Mon Mar 26, 2012 4:03 pm

I came back to a comment I made on another post......If you, or a delegate from your team do not volunteer for a job during Speedweek, then you do not get to race.
If all volunteer positions are filled then, there will be no need for the hard line.

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RGV
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Re: Post record run inspection.

Post by RGV » Mon Mar 26, 2012 5:31 pm

What dictates a critical roll? They are all critical. So we all get a cue jump pass? Kind of defeats the purpose.

Its just another job that needs to be done.

Last Minute Racing "its a 2-stroke ya twit - Its supposed to smoke"
DLRA #928
SATA #10

2010 MPS/G 250 118 MPH:)
2011 Washed Out:(
2012 Washed Out:(
2013 MPS/G 250 131 MPH (RECORD):)
2014 MPS/G 250 140 MPH (RECORD):)
2015 MPS/F 250 DNF:(

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zork
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Re: Post record run inspection.

Post by zork » Tue Mar 27, 2012 9:02 am

I agree with Dave, beware of the Gestapo.

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RGV
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Re: Post record run inspection.

Post by RGV » Tue Mar 27, 2012 12:14 pm

If all racers volunteered then we would only have to do a 1/2 day each?

Last Minute Racing "its a 2-stroke ya twit - Its supposed to smoke"
DLRA #928
SATA #10

2010 MPS/G 250 118 MPH:)
2011 Washed Out:(
2012 Washed Out:(
2013 MPS/G 250 131 MPH (RECORD):)
2014 MPS/G 250 140 MPH (RECORD):)
2015 MPS/F 250 DNF:(

grumm441
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Re: Post record run inspection.

Post by grumm441 » Tue Mar 27, 2012 7:20 pm

JonB wrote:Hi.
I have no intention of cheating and believe that the majority of others are the same.

The pre run scrutineering is for safety compliance only and should stay that way.
For our records to have any credibility a class compliance needs to be done on a vehicle that has set a record.

I understand fuel is very hard to check, other areas are not so hard.

I also understand that it is pretty difficult for someone to know the whole rulebook, I have a decent handle on the bike rules and no knowledge of the car section that isn't related to a Streamliner bike build.
Jon
Hi Jon
I have a pretty good handle on the rule book
some of my "friends" volunteered me for motorcycle tech a number of years ago and I haven't escaped yet
I work as qualified motorcycle mechanic and a LVT (licensed vehicle tester) in Melbourne so I look at a LOT of motorcycles
I also do motorcycle tech once a year at speedweek on the Bonneville salt flats, for which I am well reimbursed
There have been some discussions about running an impound at the DLRA meeting
It sounds like a good idea, but it needs a lot of staff who really know what they are doing and know the rule book back to front
They also have to spend the whole week there
Gasoline is not hard to check, we just need the appropriate instrument to do it. $$$
However as we do not have an event gasoline........
Capacity is not hard to check, and again we just need the appropriate tool. $$$
Certifying a motorcycle for a record is mainly about knowing the rule book
none of it is hard, it's just time consuming
This year I have time, next year I hope to have our lakester back out on the salt so I may not have as much time
I believe we do already have a queue jump pass running for guys who are doing full time jobs

G
They make it
I make it work

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zork
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Re: Post record run inspection.

Post by zork » Tue Mar 27, 2012 8:34 pm

BTW I did get a quote for a Dielectric constant meter for interest........

Our Reference: TJ12-668Q
Mr John Davey
ADELAIDE SA
Dear John,
In response to your request, we have pleasure in providing the following quotation
for Brookhaven Instruments Corporation:
A: BI-870 Dielectric Constant Meter ..........$10,200.00
- with 40 mL cylindrical probe
- Included is a box of BI-RCG870 cells and rack holder for cells.
OPTIONS
BI-RCG870 Box of 36 glass cells with 50 caps ..........$295.00
BI-BR870 Rack to hold glass cells ..........$295.00
The attached terms and conditions form part of this quotation

How many do you want!!

momec3
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Re: Post record run inspection.

Post by momec3 » Tue Mar 27, 2012 9:14 pm

The tool would not be required if we had an "event gas".

You would fill up and have your tank sealed, run your record and go to impound, check the seal and get a tick if the seal is not broken.

Its that simple.

I propose we look at an event gas supplier. This would be a win/win for all competitors apart from the cheats (if there are any).

All others would save money.

If you are not chasing a record you can run what you brung or save money and only buy what you need.

There would be more than one choice of " event gas" that would be legal to suit different engine combos.

Our event is big enough now that a supplier would be happy to provide the service.

The safety aspect and a central safe refueling point would be addressed with the refuel station.

We currantly have racers refueling hot cars on plastic tarps from plastic fuel cans with NO STATIC PROTECTION.

One single pit explosion would be one too many. This could easily be fixed and we will all save money.

I am happy to do the research to find a supplier for 2013 but this needs to be voted in before I procede.

Chris
Chris

grumm441
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Re: Post record run inspection.

Post by grumm441 » Tue Mar 27, 2012 10:02 pm

Yep
That's all nice, sealed tanks and all
however, they found at Bonneville, that some (one) people who will remain nameless, were able to change fuel on the way back to impound
thru the fuel lines and taps, so now they test everything that has a G on it, sealed or not sealed
that's why they changed the impound rule to read that you had to 'return immediately to impound'
Because one person found a way
If you're running in a fuel class it's not a problem
G
They make it
I make it work

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JonB
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Re: Post record run inspection.

Post by JonB » Tue Mar 27, 2012 10:40 pm

Thanks guys.

Grumm;
You don't think it could be done on a roster?
Looking at the quality of the vehicles built there is obviously some very competent people in the DLRA.
It is a role that would require more than good intentions to carry out, hence my suggestion that people for the role would be vetted at a state meeting level before being appointed.
As far as tools for displacement checking I would be happy to buy a bore and stroke checker and make it available on the proviso if it got broken it would be replaced.

Zork; do they hire testing gear or know of a customer they've sold to that would.

Momec; An event fuel supply would be a great result, for all the reasons you state.
If people knew who it was before the event they could contact them with fuel grade and likely volume required to ensure their needs are met.

As far as my comment about "critical" roles I probably chose the wrong word, full time as Grumm used explains better what I was trying to say, a role that means you need to totally leave your vehicle for a 1/2 days racing regardless wether it needs work or not deserves some reward.

All just my opinion, of the other 100+ people who have looked at and not commented im sure you have a valid opinion.
Cheers
jon
DLRA#1115
Underhouse Engineering

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zork
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Re: Post record run inspection.

Post by zork » Wed Mar 28, 2012 8:56 am

"Zork; do they hire testing gear or know of a customer they've sold to that would".

The only manufacturer I could find was in NY USA.
Contacted them and their Oz rep contacted me and supplied quote. He also said that he had not sold one in Oz before?
There would be a lab somewhere with one I should imagine.
Cheers.

turbo RB
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Re: Post record run inspection.

Post by turbo RB » Wed Mar 28, 2012 11:16 am

[quote]We all want to race, and we have trouble getting volunteers, this and some other critical roles should come with a "cue jump pass" you commit 1/2 a of "race" day, you get to cue jump once the next day.

JonDLRA#1115
WOFTAM Racing, sponsored by Underhouse Engineering
JonB

I would have to agree in some form that record breaking cars be reinspected after a record pass ( to meet class rules ) but as for the 1/2 day voluntering and cue jump ! well three people in my team are doing full days , I am doing salt inspection on the 12th may and I beleive the Silverton boys are doing the shitters for the full week ( speed week ) where do we fit in the cue ??? I / others do this for the love of the sport and to get the event off the ground , not brownie points .

So lets volunteer to do the jobs , get the event to happen , go racing and have fun

John Dickinson #635

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RGV
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Re: Post record run inspection.

Post by RGV » Wed Mar 28, 2012 12:42 pm

Turbo RB, your in the lucky position to have team members. I can not do full days as I would not be able to race. But I do 1/2 days so others can race and that gives me the other 1/2 to tune-repair and race.
If every racer did at least one 1/2 day (there are/were around 250 racers entered) most of the tasks would be covered by one shift each, people would not have to do full days or multiple 1/2 days. Of course there are people that want to do more that their fare share and to them we should all say a big THANK YOU.

And as for getting brownie points, lets just do the jobs and get on with the thing we all enjoy.

Last Minute Racing "its a 2-stroke ya twit - Its supposed to smoke"
DLRA #928
SATA #10

2010 MPS/G 250 118 MPH:)
2011 Washed Out:(
2012 Washed Out:(
2013 MPS/G 250 131 MPH (RECORD):)
2014 MPS/G 250 140 MPH (RECORD):)
2015 MPS/F 250 DNF:(

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AuotonomousRX
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Re: Post record run inspection.

Post by AuotonomousRX » Wed Mar 28, 2012 3:07 pm

I think that like a lot of things it is already clear in the rule book. :idea:

There are currently 2 types of Records

1.G RECORD RUNS:

1.G.1 ONE WAY RECORD RUNS
1.G.2 TWO WAY RECORD RUNS


Until we sort out how to implement the Two Way Records Rule, I suggest all of us run One Way Records in 2012.

From the information I have seen an Event Fuel is not one Fuel it is an Approved supplier that sells a number of approved Gas/Petrol Products.

BUB Trials

ERC Racing Fuels are the official racing gasoline vendor. If you are participating in a Gasoline class you are required to use the quality gasoline of ERC Racing Fuels. Specs on the gasoline's that ERC will have available are listed below.
ERC 110K
ERC A-19A
ERC MUL/A
ERC A-8C


Having one type of "Gas" is not really practical. Different types of engines and modifications require very different spec "Gas/Petrol".

Again Event Gas is one option, another is an Approved Gasoline List.

It can be done.

As I suggested we simply have One Way Records this year and discuss and work out the whole Records stuff at the AGM.

Pete
#866
Metric Target 250 on a 250 on a Red Bike

Pete :shock:
DLRA #866
SATA #49

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Greg Watters
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Re: Post record run inspection.

Post by Greg Watters » Wed Mar 28, 2012 4:37 pm

Pete i think the 2 way record run is not 2 directions , but like the scta just 2 runs averaged , and i'm not aware of anyone opting to do it
Erc would be happy to supply the same event fuels as they do for Bonneville, they have a Melbourne agent, and i chat to the owner daily at Bonneville while filling up and have suggested at some stage in the future we may be needing a supplier
Haven't priced them but the guys that make fuel test stuff also do a range of products i have been looking at for grain, seen this lately
http://www.zeltex.com/desktop/zx-440xl.html

The mechanical capacity testing equipmet on motorcycles requires a centre spark plug with about 150-200mm clear space above , very few bikes have this capability, Suzuki sportsbikes are ok, Kawasaki usually have to drop the front of the motor down, and many others have to remove the head anyway
Oh and there fairly fragile ..
A liquid system would probably be easier, but still require disabling of valve gear
And in the US, as i would expect here the work is not done by the inspector, you have to pull your motor down in the heat and salt, and have it ready for the inspection before he will even think about coming over to check

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